By now, the story of Anna Sorokin, the “modern-day Gatsby” who scammed New York high society and ended up at Rikers Island, is well known, a subject hashed and rehashed in news articles, podcasts, documentaries, and, soon, in upcoming series from Netflix and HBO. But we’ve yet to hear her voice. This podcast, accompanying Laura Pullman’s exclusive interview with Sorokin for the Times of London, changes that. We hear the bizarrely accented Sorokin, who was just released from prison, claiming that “in my mind I was never doing anything criminal.” When asked how she justified walking out of five-star hotels without paying the bill, she says, “It’s just how I am.” And of her time in prison, there’s no newfound regret, just: “I learned how to read people better.” Following all the coverage, you might wonder how Sorokin got away with it. This podcast offers a glimpse into the studied vagueness, the charm, the cunning, and—recalling the Ocean’s Eleven crew after its three-casino heist—the sense of pride she took in it all. —J.V.

(Since this interview, Sorokin has also sat down with the BBC’s Emily Maitlis, who last year interviewed Prince Andrew about his sweating problem and Jeffrey Epstein.)